John, But Not-So-Rotten

I'd had a lousy night's sleep. One of those terrible nights when you're constantly thinking of something you have to get up early to do in the morning, and you spend half the night waking up and snatching at the clock to make sure you haven't overslept. I'd been told by the promoters that John Lydon, who is in town later this week for a show with his band PiL, had a busy schedule and that this was likely to be the only time I could grab a word with him. 6am, on the nose, Beijing time.

As wretched as I felt, I was up at 5.40am to grab a coffee and fire up my laptop so I'd be ready to go bang on 6am. But his phone just rang and rang. I was fuming. Here I am waking up at silly o'clock to grab a few words with him and he can't even be arsed to answer the phone. I imagined him silencing my call and just going on doing whatever it is that old punks do.

I called the promoters, and then waited by the phone while they tried to contact his agent in LA to find out what was happening. Fifteen minutes passed, then 30, then 45. By then, having decided that it wasn't going to happen, I went to shower before heading out to the office. When I got out ten minutes later, I had three text messages:

06:50 - "CALL HIM NOW. HE'S WAITING"

06:54 - "WHY HAVNT YOU CALLED HIM?!!!"

06:59 - "HE SAYS IT'S TOO LATE NOW. DO NOT CALL NOW"

A few days later, the promoters informed me that I was very lucky: I could have another go at the interview at 6am the following Saturday morning. 6am. On my day off, no less.

This time around, I decided to change tack. He'd annoyed me and I thought it'd be quite funny to get a tongue-lashing from Johnny Rotten, so I set out to goad him.

It turned out he was far too nice to dole out a lashing.

Do you ever miss anything about home?
Yeah, I miss not being arrested all the time.

I was thinking more along the lines of missing sausage rolls or pasties. So what brings you to China?
The Chinese! It wasn't my idea, they asked us, and then the government approved of my lyrics. Isn't that amazing?

It is pretty amazing. We heard a rumor a while ago but never thought it would happen. I mean, the likes of Oasis got turned away ...
Oh well, then common sense prevails.

Did you ever think you'd be an old punk?
I don't think of myself as old yet. I'm only 56. Barely half a century. When I'm a hundred, I'll let you know.

What does an old punk still have to offer?
My value system, which is still as correct and forthright and proper as always. Age to me is a very excellent thing. Like a fine wine, I mature well.

So you're getting better as you get older?
Yes, and I'm exploring all different musical possibilities. To me, punk should never be as limited as the media make it. There were too many copycats and the whole thing became a cliché very, very quickly. And smart bunnies like me kept ahead of the pack. I'm not one to be amongst the flock ... baaaa.

Did you ever think PiL would still be going after this much time?
The record industry tried to make sure that that would not be the case. I had to independently raise the money, and it took me nearly two decades to buy my way out of those contracts. But I will continue, because this is the one thing I love to do more than anything.

So you always intended to have a long career in music?
I don't think of it as a career, I see it as ... I like explaining my life.

You mentioned how you worked to get yourself out of contracts. Are you dismayed that a certain generation of young people will grow up knowing you for butter adverts and celebrity shows rather than for being a seminal punk artist?

I did ‘I'm a Celebrity’ for charity. Completely. I raised nearly a quarter-of-a-million pounds for charity, and that is the only reason I did it. I never earned one penny out of it and I didn't use that money for PiL.

John appearing on the UK reality TV show "I'm a Celebrity, Get Me Out of Here" before he walked off the show

The Country Life ads were the most anarchistic thing that anybody had ever put forward to me. They gave me a complete free hand, so I improvised. And quite literally, turned what would be a normal advertising campaign into a very excellent little film, which is the proper Public Image approach, and it helped get us back together.

John starring in "the most anarchistic thing ever put to him"

I know there's been the term 'cop out' and 'sell out', but you have to explain what those terms mean, because I have never, ever, ever conceded my sense of value. I'm a smart lad, I'm a working-class lad – I come from absolute shit – anyone who offers me money for nothing, I ain't gonna say 'no'. Y'know, council flats don't raise stupid children.

What's the biggest misconception about John Lydon?
That he's handsome, because he ain't. No matter how many times I tell people I am, I know they’re not believing it.

Is there anything you'd have done differently?
No, I don't have hindsight, and I don't think it's a healthy thing. What you have to be is well aware and self-educated enough to be able to see an opportunity as soon as it arises.

What did you make of the use of Sex Pistols material at the 2012 London Olympics Opening Ceremony?
I approved it wholeheartedly. I met Danny Boyle and I had a very long and interesting conversation with him. He was telling me that the whole thing was based around the National Health Service, which is something I completely support, and it was from the point of view of working-class Britain. And the thrill was to watch the whole of the Royal Family endure The Sex Pistols for one minute and thirty seconds.

Punk has been bastardized since the early days. Do you feel in any way responsible for the likes of US garage punk bands like Sum 41 and Blink 182?
Well, the worst example for me is Green Day. A bunch of coat hangers. Do I feel responsible for that? No, but it's a shame that that's how they ended up taking it. The best thing they ever did was call their album American Idiot. That was bang on the money!

I like Nirvana, but when they called their album Nevermind – again, what a cop-out. But then it summed up American punk for me. Y'know, it's "Never Mind" without the "Bollocks".

Who was the worst person to ever say they love your music?
Probably Christina Aguilera. She started to wear our T-shirts and stuff. I've seen Beyonce in a Sex Pistols T-shirt, but then again, she wore it really well.

Do you feel in any way responsible for the amount of swearing on TV, because you were one of the early pioneers of the broadcasted swear word?

Yes, well I think the difference is that I use all of the English language, and I use every word appropriately. It's not just for shock value. I'm trying to impress exactly what it is I'm clearly defining, rather than the cheapo shock value you're seeing at the moment.

The Sex Pistols legendary appearance on ITV. The episode saw them rocket to national infamy

What's the best insult you've ever received?
The best I ever received? Erm, oh yeah, "You're Sid Vicious, aren't ye?"

What are you listening to at the moment?
Bits and pieces. I don't mind chart music. I don't mind abstract, for me it's all across the board. As long as it is that whoever is making the noise sounds like it comes from the heart and the soul, I'm into it.

So you're not against pop music?
No, I love pop music. I've always said my first band, The Sex Pistols, was a pop band. When I say pop music, I mean working-class music. That's where I firmly stand, because I think the best messages come out in those short, sharp, sweet and to-the-point kind of things that pop music can offer. Not too clever, y'know?

Aww, you've ruined that for me. I was hoping you were gonna say that you hate all mainstream music.
Oh, come on. You were young once. You remember how hard it was to get a girl when you were young. Y'know, you've gotta love your pop music.

But I wanted my headline to be: "Johnny Rotten is a Hipster."
I have never worn hipsters in my life.

See John Lydon and PiL live at Yugong Yishan on Saturday Mar 30. Tickets cost RMB 280 and are available here.

Photo: Screened.com